GM and Chrysler

[Max]

I think there were a lot of us that didn't want to bail out the car companies. Does anyone know what the cost to date has been? And this is all money that will never be repaid now that they filed bankruptcy but I'm betting the figure including the bankruptcy and cash for clunkers probably exceeds 50 billion now but haven't heard for sure.

I noticed in yesterdays speech Obama bragged on the 17& return from the bailouts of banks but didn't mention the fact that only 70 billion of 800 billion had been repaid. In the end it will be a huge loss for the taxpayer. Probably over 500 billion will never find it's way home, and that doesn't include the 300 billion for AIG. Just pisses me off when I know my tax dollars are being used to support this.

[HoldHard]

He's giving a speech at a GM plant today Link (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/09/15/raw-data-obamas-remarks-workers-gm-plant/)

Sometimes, that involves making tough decisions that have been put off for too long. Now, as I've said before, I didn't run for President to manage auto companies. It wasn't something on my to-do list. It wasn't even something on my want-to-do list. I wasn't going to put any more tax dollars on the line if it meant perpetuating the bad business decisions that led to this point. But in the midst of a deep recession and financial crisis, the collapse of the auto industry would have caused enormous damage to our economy. So we intervened for one simple and compelling reason: your survival and the success of our economy depended on it.

Some folks in Washington have already forgotten just what it was we walked into eight months ago. So let's just go through the facts of where we were. A financial system near collapse. 700,000 workers losing their jobs each month. A sudden decline in credit that made it very difficult to take out home loans, auto loans, student loans, or small business loans. It was so bad that experts of all political persuasions feared a second coming of the Great Depression.

So we took bold, swift action to make sure that didn't happen. We moved to keep responsible homeowners in their homes and jumpstart lending. And we passed a sweeping Recovery Act without any of the usual Washington earmarks or pork-barrel spending - and that plan is working.

Now this is important. One-third of that plan went to tax relief. We cut your taxes. We cut taxes for 95 percent of America's working families - 4.5 million families in Ohio alone - and we cut taxes for small businesses on the investments they make.

Another third was emergency relief. For Americans who were laid off, we extended unemployment benefits - a measure that made a difference for 12 million Americans, including 570,000 right here in Ohio. We made health insurance 65 percent cheaper for families relying on COBRA while looking for work. We saved the jobs of tens of thousands of state and local workers, including 336 police officers right here in Ohio.

The last third is investing in your towns and your future. Just as one example of many, over in Canfield, we awarded a competitive contract to a local company to repair a bridge on Route 11. That allowed them to avoid layoffs they were otherwise going to make. And that allowed local folks to keep coming to work, doing the work America needs done.

More of the same..... speeches crafted for the exact need....

HH

[MYCAR47562]

does anyone know how car sales is doing?

[right$pecial]

does anyone know how car sales is doing?

My former roommate, the car salesman, was let go soon after cash for clunkers ended. His management either knew this would happen or idiotically thought that their product was what brought people in rather than the massive government incentives. Don't know if this is indicative of the rest of the country, but I've long suspected that anyone in line to buy a new car did so during the program and now the dealerships are in for a massive dry spell. Only time will tell.

[HoldHard]

The other problem is that the dealerships inventory has been depleted and without the auto plants returning to work, getting anything back into the pipeline will take weeks or months.

Dealerships are getting hit with a double whammy right now as there are no customers in the showroom and the payments from the government on the "Cash for Clunkers" program have not arrived.... Bottom line, the owners have cut costs and reduced headcount to stem the negative cashflow.

Some dealerships refused to honor the "Clunker" program because they knew it would hurt them financially.

HH

[Remphoto]

The other problem is that the dealerships inventory has been depleted and without the auto plants returning to work, getting anything back into the pipeline will take weeks or months.

Dealerships are getting hit with a double whammy right now as there are no customers in the showroom and the payments from the government on the "Cash for Clunkers" program have not arrived.... Bottom line, the owners have cut costs and reduced headcount to stem the negative cashflow.

Some dealerships refused to honor the "Clunker" program because they knew it would hurt them financially.

HH


Exactly. I know it has been said many times on here, but this was one inept program. Just sped up sales that probably would have happened in the near future, took good usable cars off the road and provided a taxpayer subsidy for those who would have used their own money to eventually buy a car. And did it with no sense of perspective as to available inventory, a system to promptly reimburse the dealers and other unintended consequences. And they want to control our healthcare?

[Max]

I guess my point was that isn't really the money we paid GM and Chrysler nothing more then fulfilling a campaign promise of Obama to the unions? Wouldn't we as taxpayers be better off to just give every candidate a billion or so dollars to stop this from happening in the future?

[Al the Auto Mechanic]

Where did the several hundred billions of dollars go from the check that the asshole before BO wrote?

[Al the Auto Mechanic]

So TARP money didn't really "go" anywhere. But banks may have to go to their lawyers to explain that.

Bank of America got Wall Street excited recently when its chief executive, Ken Lewis, said he planned to pay back the $45 billion in TARP money the company had received.

My question is, with what?

Lewis hedged by saying that the payback will occur "when we see the economy improving" and "absent some unexpected meltdown."


I wish I could walk in and demand a TARP loan for myself,my wife and to expand a business then not account for how I want to expand and what we need in our household!
Then use part of the free money to defend my corrupt ass.

Damn man.How can this happen and no one can do anything about it but add more funds to an apparent failing attempt?

[Max]

Bank of America got Wall Street excited recently when its chief executive, Ken Lewis, said he planned to pay back the $45 billion in TARP money the company had received.

My question is, with what?



They plan to pay it back buy selling more stock. Stock that already is over valued and worthless IMHO. It's like AIG and many others that they are booming in the market now but in reality the companies are worthless and so far under water that at some point taxpayers are going to lose big. I also heard that as many as 300 banks may still fail because they are on the edge and all the toxic assets that started this melt down they say most still remain and that tarp did nothing to correct this issue.

[Jeb]

Damn shell game!

[Al the Auto Mechanic]

Isn't this something?
This shit has been going on since about 2000.
I read a couple day or 2 old articles on this and you are right about selling the stock.They plan on selling it back to the government,who will in turn give out more printed money for the purchase.Seems it isn't going to stop untill the U.S. is good and broke.

I also heard that the combined bailout for the auto industry is close to 80 billion so far.

[Max]

I also heard that the combined bailout for the auto industry is close to 80 billion so far.


I wouldn't be a bit surprised by this number. I know just the bankruptcy cost a fortune for the tax payer. More money that the tax payer will never get back but was a huge advantage for unions.