Joe the Plumber

[Engels]

Is anyone buying this?

Let's start with the "truthiness" of the whole thing:

1) He's not really named Joe (real name: Samuel Wurzelbacher)

2) Not licensed as a plumber.

And on closer examination, his plan to buy a plumbing business seems to belong more in the realm of fantasy than genuine aspiration - especially since he now has a publicist who is out trying to get the guy a country & western recording contract.

Is this really the best the McCain campaign can come up with a week before the election? Could they really not find a believable real American who actually would be worse off under Obama's tax proposal? (Peter the Pediatrician - struggling to pay his student loans and super-jumbo mortgage on the $450,000 a year he takes home?)

If someone came to me and said "Yeah, I make about $300,000 a year, and the extra couple of grand I'm gonna have to pay under the Obama plan really pisses me off" - I'd at least understand his support for McCain. But some joker making less than $100K just doesn't seem to understand they'd be far better off with the Obama deal.

[gtrman66]

I'm buying it.

Obama was stumping in the guy's front yard.

His name is Samuel Joseph Wurzelbacher. My dad uses our common middle name. So does my best friend and several other people I know.

He asked a question. Since when do we rip into average citizen's lives for "asking a question"? It could have just as easily been you. Why are not the people featured on the Obama-mercial being ripped into? Because it is a double standard.

Of course the RNC machine is going to capitalize on this and so is Joe.

Obama was "caught" spewing Socialism. (Out of the heart the mouth speaketh) That's the real issue. He is a Marxist through and through.

God help us all Wednesday morning.

[MYCAR47562]

I Think If Any Of Us Would Have Caught On Like That We Would Have Been Ripped To Pieces. To Bad Politics Are Like That. But Seems Democrats Have A Way Of Trying To Get People Arrested When They Do It

[Engels]

Just to stick to facts:

It was John McCain who brought up "Joe" the Plumber's name in the Presidential debate. Had Sen. McCain not done so, I doubt anybody would care less about Samuel Wurzelbacher.

Having made Mr. Wurzelbacher a symbol of his campaign, it seems somewhat unrealistic to expect that the media would NOT want to find out a little more about the guy. And if finding out readily and publically available information (like his not having a plumber's license and owing back taxes) counts as "ripping apart" someone - then you shouldn't interject yourself into a political campaign.

Making matters more laughable, Mr. Wurzelbacher has seen fit to insert himself into the campaign. Offering such gems as his agreement with the individual who asserted that Obama would "mean the death of Israel." When confronted by Shepard Smith on Fox News, Mr. Wurzelbacher was seemingly unable to to provide any plausible rationale for this assertion. Shepard Smith finally offered up the following:

"I just want to make this 100 percent perfectly clear -- Barack Obama has said repeatedly and demonstrated repeatedly that Israel will always be a friend of the United States, no matter what happens once he becomes President of the United States. His words." He later added "The rest of it -- man...some things -- it just gets frightening sometimes. We'll be right back."

Samuel "Joe" Wurzelbacher made about $40,000 in 2006. Under the tax proposal of Barack Obama, at this income level he would probably enjoy a Federal tax cut of between $600 and $800. Under John McCain he would get nothing.

If proposing to allow lower and moderate-income individuals like Samuel Wurzelbacher to keep more of their income, while (slightly) increasing the Federal taxes of higher income individuals is an example of someone "spewing Socialism" - then there really isn't any point in discussing this any further.

If you make more than $200,000-250,000 a year - then absolutely, then it is likely your taxes are going up under an Obama tax plan. But if not, then chances are you will be much better off financially with Obama than you would be with McCain.

[gtrman66]

Ah my poor little buddy. Facts are such a pain for you to deal with.

I could give a rat's behind about Joe. It was NEVER about Joe. It was about the words "When you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody". I would bet my last dollar that WHOEVER asked ANY question that lead to that statement being spoken, they would have found themselves in the media rectal exam of their lives. It matters not if it was Joe, Bob, or Engels. It was an attempt to cover up the fact the man is not only the most liberal Senator of all time, he is a true Marxist (there is no debating it).

Are you telling me that there is nothing someone could find out about you that might be true, flase, misconstrued or otherwise make you look bad? Everyone has something that can be twisted. Obama has his illegal aunt on welfare. The man has millions and doesn't take care of his own? Shameful.

With 9000+ pages of tax code, could Joe have screwed up? Sure. He needs to pay up, but it could have been an oversight. Many plumbing companies (varies by state) cover their employees by having 1 licensed plumber on staff. Who knows the laws in his state? I don't. Did you research it? I doubt the media did either. Again, it ain't about Joe - that is a smokescreen to cover for when Obama when "off-script".

Obama is good friends with Rashid Khalidi (PLO). There is no denying the connection, nor the fact that Rashid Khalidi wants Israel wiped off the face of the map. Watch us severe ties shortly after BO takes office.

You deny the progressive tax we have is SOCIALIST????
From the Communist Manifesto, point #2
2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
Take the blinders off.

It was $250k, then Biden lowered it to $150k and now $120k per Bill Richardson. They are getting closer to you and me at a rapid rate.

You wanted facts? You got it.

[Engels]

I could give a rat's behind about Joe. It was NEVER about Joe.

But then of course, earlier today we had

I'm buying it..

Obviously when facts get uncomfortable for you, its time to change the subject. To more of your right-wing nutjob nonsense. Like the Rashid Khalidi b/s. In case you weren't aware of this, John McCain, as President of International Republican Institute, provided $500,000 for the Center for Palestine Research and Studies, which was founded by Khalidi.

Bottom line: Khalidi isn't a terrorist. John McCain wouldn't have given him the grant money if he was. And nor would Obama have attended a farewell dinner for him at the University of Chicago in 2003. (That's about the extent of their relationship.)

But he's got a Arabic-sounding name and he's an easy target for the dimmer minded members of our society.

Enjoy the punch and cookies at the Bob Barr Victory party tomorrow night.

[MYCAR47562]

so your saying that because he he asked obama the question that lead to him spewing socialism he deserved to have the fact the he owes back taxes put out in front of the whole world? and yes i stand behind the fact that democrats seems to try to get people put in jail, look at palin and all the crap they tryed to pin on her, and i believe slowly but shurely the truth is coming out on everyone of those charges.


and how can you say spreading the wealth isnt socialism? isnt it taking from one to give to another so its a more even playing field? why dont you go wiki socialism and tell me what you think of the plan.

as far as Khalidi so its the same thing to be part of a board which usually has 10 people from what i have seen, to vote on issue's like that. going to one dinner thrown for him which was probally just because of the money donated to his company. and having a long friendship with someone as being the same thing?

[MYCAR47562]

engels i have a question for you and no its not loaded(at least i dont think) but

What do you think about bidens comment that if elected the world will test obama with a terriostic attack?

[gtrman66]

I jumped on your Joe bait... I am buying that he was an average guy, minding his own business and asked a question that he thought was relevant. Had BO answered "on script", it would not have made even the local news.

Now, I am not the one that changed the subject, you put in Joe's thoughts on Israel. I merely commented on them and added the fact that BO has enough shady associations and gaffes that lead me to believe that Israel will be cut off from the US very shortly.

I do not care about his name. I never brought it up. You did.

I'll enjoy the punch, while you enjoy the kool-aid.

[MYCAR47562]

purple kool-aid

[MYCAR47562]

engels im still waiting on your answer

[Engels]

What do you think about bidens comment that if elected the world will test obama with a terriostic attack?

If I recall correctly, Biden did not specify a "terrorist attack." He said that there would be some sort of "international...generated crisis" (his words) designed to test Obama. This could take many forms - deployment or testing of nuclear weapons by North Korea or Iran; Russian aggression in Georgia; a Chinese move against Taiwan; etc. etc.

I have a tremendous respect for Joe Biden. He's served in the Senate for thirty five years(!) and has chaired the influential Foreign Relations committee. His experience dealing with United States foreign policy issues would be an invaluable asset to any administration.

But with that said, he has a well-known history of sometimes saying things that - while "true" (in the sense that they really are his personal beliefs or hunches) are not what we might call "political."

Obviously Biden has no real knowledge of a pending International incident - if he did, the US government would take steps to forestall it. So his "prediction" is just that - a guy speaking out loud his "hunch." Maybe he is thinking back to similar "tests" that were put to incoming US Presidents: The "Cuban Missle Crisis" of 1962 is sometimes seen as a "test" of the then relatively inexperienced John Kennedy. (Current historical analysis of Soviet Premier Kruschev's actions at this time does not bear out the 1962 Crisis as a manufactured "test" - more likely it was a miscalculation on the part of the Soviets.)

While it probably was impolitic of Biden to make the comments exactly as he did, it is important to look at the context in which they were made. A US Senator, with perhaps more foreign policy experience than anyone else in government, felt that Obama had demonstrated the judgement, and coolness of mind, to be ideally suited to handle any such crisis. If Biden thought, for the tiniest fraction of a second, that Obama would be incapable of handling a crisis - he would never have agreed to be on his ticket.

[MYCAR47562]

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/10/20/biden-obamas-inexperience-will-prompt-nations-to-test-us/

read that and tell me what you think.

seems that the russian goverment called jfk a wuss and people compare them all the time

["shazbat"]

Or Biden might be taking a calculated bet of where his postion will be when some sicko Aryan white supremacist whacko pops a cap on Obama and thus makes Biden the president by default.
I don't see where anyone can take Obama's record seriously as he basically has none. Ah but lets ignore the obvious in favor of the celebrity parade to cover him with support and accolades. Queen Oprah loves him as does the media machine. That's enough for the simple minded.
I'm looking for substance and coming up with bupkis.
As for Joe, fuck him. I haven't seen him and don't care.

[MYCAR47562]

id rather have the at least honest talking sometimes joe biden than the salesman he's running with

[gtrman66]

Biden is a gaffe machine. He makes Palin seem like an intellectual. His "presidency" would be on par with Ford. - that would be cool!

[Ghost]

id rather have the at least honest talking sometimes joe biden than the salesman he's running with

Damn man, are you saying that you hope your President gets shot?/

[Ghost]

Seems like your guy might have some issues with truthfulness:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEtZlR3zp4c

[Ghost]

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/10/20/biden-obamas-inexperience-will-prompt-nations-to-test-us/

read that and tell me what you think.

seems that the russian goverment called jfk a wuss and people compare them all the time


I would be careful about relying on information from a website called "hotair". Written with kind of a slant dont ya think?

The writer states that Biden said that because of Obama's lack of foreign policy experience he will be tested with a foreign crisis. Then he has the balls to give Biden's quote. VP Biden never mentions a lack of foreign policy experience and its a fact that all new Presidents are tested, not necessarily with terrorism but tested.

Do you remember a little thing that happened in New York City, the Pentagon and in a field in Pennsylvania, commonly referred to as 9-11?? Less than 8 months after Bush 43 took office, hmmmm.

[The G]

Joe The plumber ended up look like a smuck.

[MYCAR47562]

Damn man, are you saying that you hope your President gets shot?/

wow that a way to twist my words
i guess you can say i dont like my president elect yes. do i want him shot, no. 3 reasons
1 of course then i would have to see obama memorials for the rest of my life.
2. i dont want some area nation deuch bag thinking he did everybody a favor
3. (conspiricy theorist coming out) if he gets shot i believe he will defie the odds and survive but making a miricial(sorry) recovery, and that will make the beginings of the antichrist

[gtrman66]

Joe The plumber ended up look like a smuck.

You would to, had you asked the question that caused BO to gaffe. You would have a Main-stream-media rectal exam you would never be able to live down.

It wasn't about Joe, it was the socialist/Marxist Fruedian slip.

["shazbat"]

Damn man, are you saying that you hope your President gets shot?/

Speaking for my self and anyone else that's lived through both the JFK and riots following the MLK assasinations would answer an unequivocal NO.
That said there have already been arrests made related to plots to assasinate Obama.
When you consider the attempt against Reagan was a nut job whacko the possibilty of a truly organized attempt for reasons of race or policy differences is more real than for any president since JFK.

[The G]

You would to, had you asked the question that caused BO to gaffe. You would have a Main-stream-media rectal exam you would never be able to live down.

It wasn't about Joe, it was the socialist/Marxist Fruedian slip. No I wouldn't. Hes a putsz, he tried to play the cards he was handed and didn't know how.

[MYCAR47562]

thats a brave assumption there even i who knows of my only skelton would be worried about them

[gtrman66]

No I wouldn't. Hes a putsz, he tried to play the cards he was handed and didn't know how.

If I had a team of tax lawyers at my beck and call, I'm sure I can find a loophole somewhere that has you owing some money in your lifetime. Been married more than once... rent a "questionable" video.... been to a bachelor party... serve on any community boards that could twist your association... a little myspace picture you don't want seen...believe me, they could find something.

[Ghost]

Speaking for my self and anyone else that's lived through both the JFK and riots following the MLK assasinations would answer an unequivocal NO.
That said there have already been arrests made related to plots to assasinate Obama.
When you consider the attempt against Reagan was a nut job whacko the possibilty of a truly organized attempt for reasons of race or policy differences is more real than for any president since JFK.

There have been plots busted that were aimed at every President since Reagan. There will always be some radical/fringe group out there that wants to be "validated" and, in their measly minds, what better way than to go after the most powerful person in the world.

[MYCAR47562]

There have been plots busted that were aimed at every President since Reagan. There will always be some radical/fringe group out there that wants to be "validated" and, in their measly minds, what better way than to go after the most powerful person in the world.

VERY TRUE BUT I BELIEVE THIS ONE WILL BRING OUT EVEN THE SMART ONES WHICH IS SCARY

[Ghost]

VERY TRUE BUT I BELIEVE THIS ONE WILL BRING OUT EVEN THE SMART ONES WHICH IS SCARY

That would be interesting because I didn't know there were "SMART" Presidential Assassin wannabes out there. Hmmmm, something new everyday.

[MYCAR47562]

by smart i mean ones who dont put it out on the internet or tell friend by smart i mean the ones who will accually do it not talk about it

[Ghost]

Oh ok, I guess we have different definitions of SMART, but that's ok.

[MYCAR47562]

smart isnt the right word but you see what i mean and im not talking about those 2 tennesse boys

[Ghost]

More resourceful maybe? I don't wanna put words in your mouth, may not be room with that foot in there. lol

[MYCAR47562]

I Wouldnt Even Use Resourceful Anybody Can Buy A Rifle That Could Assinate The President Its More Along The Lines Of Intelligent Enough To Not Run There Mouths About It